Hansard, 2000-07-03

Under the provisions of clause 2(d) of Article 46 of the Constitution of the Republic of Singapore, the following Member has been granted permission to be or to remain absent from sittings of Parliament (or any Committee of Parliament to which he has been appointed) for the period stated: NameFromTo (2000)(2000) Assoc Prof Toh See Kiat11 Jul15 Jul TAN SOO KHOON Speaker Parliament of Singapore

Order for Second Reading read.

Mr Speaker, Sir, I beg to move, "That the Bill be now read a Second time." The Bill seeks to amend the Auctioneers' Licences Act to give legislative effect to remove the need for licensing of auctioneers. Rationale The Auctioneers' Licences Act, which was enacted in 1906, licenses auctioneers, appraisers and house agents. The Act serves to regulate persons who conduct the sale of goods or any other properties through open bidding. We have looked at the relevance of licensing auctioneers today, and have concluded that there is no need to license auctioneers. Auctioning is a mode of sale. A good sold by auction could be similarly sold by direct sale, telemarketing or exhibition sale. Other modes of sale such as direct sales, telemarketing or exhibition sales are not licensed. An auction sale is open and subscribes to willing buyer and willing seller principles. Buyers and sellers enter into mutually agreeable contractual terms in the sale. Therefore, they are in the position to determine what are mutually agreeable terms of sale without the need for another safety net via licensing. Feedback from auctioneers who are currently licensed indicate that the various trades see little value in the licensing requirement. The removal of licensing is not expected to have adverse impact on their activities. In addition, removing the need to apply for a licence would make it easier for auctioneers to carry out their work, and could encourage more professional auctioning activities to be based in Singapore. Proposed Amendments The Bill makes the following amendments to the Auctioneers' Licences Act: (a) to change the title of the Act to Appraisers and House Agents Act; (b) to remove the definition of auctioneers and the requirements imposed on them in conducting auctioning activities; (c) to remove any reference to auctioneers in the various sections of the Act; (d) to have the transitional provision to deem all auctioneers to have the appraiser and house agent licences until 31st December 2000; and (e) to amend the schedule to the Act. Transition Measures As a transition measure, auctioneers, who hold licences for the auction of land and building and immovable properties and are engaged in the appraisal or sale or rental of such properties, will be deemed to hold an appraiser or house agent licence as the case may be until the expiry of their licences on 31st December 2000. Thereafter, those who wish to continue to perform appraisal or house agent services will have to apply for the appropriate licence of appraiser or house agent. Sir, I beg to move.

Question put, and agreed to. Bill accordingly read a Second time and committed to a Committee of the whole House. The House immediately resolved itself into a Committee on the Bill. - [Dr Richard Hu Tsu Tau]. Bill considered in Committee; reported without amendment; read a Third time and passed.

Order for Second Reading read.

Mr Speaker, Sir, I beg to move, "That the Bill be now read a Second time." Sir, the National Council of Social Service or NCSS leads, funds, supports and guides voluntary welfare organisations or VWOs and provides the crucial link between them and the Government. The Bill seeks to amend the NCSS Act to enable the Council to remain relevant and responsive to the fast-developing social service sector. A decade ago, NCSS had around 180 VWOs registered as member organisations. By March this year, it had 259 members. The amendments will strengthen the Council's ability to lead and guide the voluntary sector effectively and develop professionalism in social service provision. This will benefit all Singaporeans who use the services provided by NCSS and its various member organisations. Strengthening the NCSS Leadership Let me now touch on the provisions aimed at strengthening the NCSS leadership. The first relates to the provision for an additional Vice-President. The NCSS Act currently provides for one elected Vice-President who assists the President, and assumes the latter's responsibilities in his absence. The President's responsibilities have been increasing steadily, in tandem with the rapid development of, and demands in, the social service sector. In view of this, clause 3 of the Bill introduces a provision for a second Vice-President to be appointed by the Minister, in consultation with the President of NCSS. Besides strengthening Board leadership, it will offer the President an additional avenue to groom potential successors, thereby enhancing succession planning in the Council. The second main change is the removal of the provision for three co-opted members on the NCSS Board. These members were originally included to bring in additional expertise to the Board in specific areas (such as human resource, public relations and training). They cannot vote and are not fully involved in, and accountable for, the proper governance of NCSS. The Council would like to see all Board members being accountable and active participants. The proposed change will strengthen board governance. With this change, the NCSS Board will have a maximum of 23 members, from the current 25. It will be trimmer but it will be stronger. Representation on the NCSS Board and the Council The next few provisions deal with the proper conduct of representation on the NCSS Board and the Council. Currently, there is no prohibition against persons representing more than one member organisation. This entitles some members to multiple votes at the Annual General Meeting, if they hold positions in several organisations and are authorised by these organisations to represent them. There is a risk that one person or a group of persons could have a disproportionate influence on the governance of NCSS. While we have thus far been fortunate not to have encountered this problem, it is wise to prevent it from happening. With increased active citizenship, we can expect more people to be involved in the voluntary sector, and in more than one organisation at any one time. Hence, clause 11 introduces a provision to prohibit persons from acting as an official representative of more than one member organisation. Employees of NCSS or member organisations are also currently not barred from serving on the Board or participating in Board elections. To prevent any potential conflict of interest, clause 3 of the Bill therefore introduces a new provision to bar employees of the NCSS or member organisations from serving on the Board and from participating in the election of Board members. Powers to Establish Institutions NCSS currently does not have the power to set up autonomous entities or institutions. This limits its scope of action. Clause 7 of the Bill therefore introduces a provision to empower the NCSS to form bodies corporate or incorporate or joint ventures to carry out its objectives. I must emphasise here that this provision does not mean that NCSS will go into business. NCSS will indeed remain a non profit-making entity focused on its primary mission, which is to promote, develop and provide effective social services in Singapore. However, this change would enable it to set up more focused or specialised institutions to achieve its stated objectives more effectively. One such institution is the National Volunteer Centre (NVC), the recently established national body for promoting volunteerism. The NVC currently exists as a committee. With the proposed amendment to the Act, the NVC can become an autonomous entity under the NCSS Act. As an autonomous agency, the NVC will be able to focus more effectively on its mandate of promoting volunteerism in Singapore. It will enable NVC to establish its own administrative capability and so operate with greater speed and flexibility. The change will make for more effective decision-making and governance, as NVC will be able to focus on all sectors instead of just the social sector, as is NCSS' mission. It will also be able to develop a distinct identity and garner support more effectively as an organisation dedicated to the promotion of volunteerism. Maintaining Standards of Professionalism Among Member Organisations NCSS plays an important role in ensuring that the voluntary welfare organisations affiliated to it are well managed and provide an acceptable standard of professional practice. As the voluntary sector grows, NCSS will need to play an even more critical role in ensuring that standards are met. Of particular concern will be the standards of service provision, fund raising, and financial management. VWOs provide services to some of the more vulnerable members of the community. Clients therefore must trust VWOs to provide sound and professional advice. The VWOs are also responsible for making good use of funds generously provided by the community. Although the vast majority of VWOs fully deserve the respect and trust of the community for their high standards of professionalism and service, there may be a need for NCSS to nudge a VWO or two to improve its management or services. NCSS provides grants and other assistance to its member organisations. It guides the sector by issuing guidelines, guide books, manuals on operating concepts and so on. It also guides and directs agencies through its selection of programmes to fund, through initiating new programmes with selected VWOs, and through consultancy advice. However, if an agency refuses to comply with guidelines on services or on other management issues like finance and fund raising, and this leads to a deterioration in services or mismanagement, NCSS can only remove funding. It has no power to investigate complaints or inquire into the management of its member organisations should the situation call for it. Clauses 7 and 13 of the Bill therefore amend the Act to empower the NCSS to investigate complaints, exercise control over and if necessary, discipline errant member organisations. NCSS will thus be in a stronger position to ensure that member organisations maintain acceptable standards of accountability and service provision. In this way, NCSS will be better able to safeguard the interest of clients who require the services provided by VWOs and the community which provides generous support to these VWOs. Concluding Remarks Mr Speaker, Sir, these proposed amendments will strengthen the Board's position as the umbrella organisation of the social service sector. Collectively, the measures enable NCSS to remain relevant and progressive in the face of a dynamic and growing social service sector. Sir, I beg to move. Question proposed.

Mr Speaker, Sir, I rise to support the proposed amendments. Sir, it is really important that we have good leadership in the voluntary organisations. The very fact that they are voluntary in nature, we tend to think that the people who are managing them become less accountable. This is not necessarily so. If all voluntary organisations are to become effective and responsive to the needs of not only the low income families, but also other families that require help, then we should have an effective management. I am pleased to note that the amendments would strengthen the capacity of the Council to respond to new needs and new challenges. It is important at this juncture that voluntary organisations, not only the National Council of Social Service, but also other relevant community sectors, look at how they can meet the needs of those who require assistance. And with the new issues and problems related to families, children and young persons, it is very important that the organisation undertakes a review to see how its leadership has the capacity to mobilize the participation of volunteers in the organisation and make it more responsive. What I would like to find out from the Minister is whether the restructuring that is undertaken at the Council will provide that flexibility for it to garner more community support and also to instruct and guide these organisations that are affiliated to the Council to meet new challenges. Sir, the other crucial factor that needs to be addressed is the leadership in the organisation itself, particularly the leadership in the National Council of Social Service. As we know, in most voluntary organisations, the leadership is graying. Therefore, it is very important to ensure that there is renewal of its leadership in the organisation itself, particularly the National Council of Social Service. So I want to find out whether these changes do allow the Council itself to undertake leadership renewal within its rank and thus encourage younger people to be involved in the organisation. The third area is the ownership of the National Council of Social Service by the voluntary sector itself. The Bill covers an element of nomination by the Ministry of Community Development as well as by election process. So I would like to find out whether these changes will, in any way, have an impact on the issue of ownership by the voluntary organisations of the Council itself. What I am trying to say is that it is very important that we ensure the participation of volunteers and that the voluntary organisations are entrenched and further strengthened so that we will be able to encourage more people to take an active interest in trying to promote problem solving within the community. I would like to ask the Minister whether the ownership by the voluntary sector is further enhanced by such changes that are being proposed. Sir, with that note, I would like to support the amendments.

(In Mandarin): Mr Speaker, Sir, the National Council of Social Service (NCSS) has now a total of 259 voluntary welfare organisations (VWOs) under its charge. The main purpose of NCSS is to help the needy, the handicapped and the elderly people by providing the necessary services to them. It leads, supports and guides the various VWOs, and helps them to raise funds to pay for their operating expenses. The NCSS has also played a very important role as a bridge between the Government and the VWOs so that the various departments in the Government would understand the needs of the people and to make prompt responses to satisfy the needs of the people. This amendment provides for an additional Vice-President to assist the President and assume the latter's responsibilities in his absence. This will provide better leadership in the Council and to ensure that all the affiliated organisations will operate in a better and more efficient manner. All the members of the Council must make good use of the resources contributed by members of the public and to help those who really need assistance, in a fair and open manner. Mr Speaker, Sir, all the members of the National Council of Social Service are serving on a voluntary basis. They do not get any salary and they sacrifice their precious time to help all the people in the society who need their assistance and services. This spirit of love and concern for the people is certainly worthy of our praises and admiration. With our population ageing more and more rapidly, in time to come, there will be more and more people who would need such services and the National Council of Social Service will certainly be assuming heavier responsibilities in the future. There should be a more effective channel to provide such assistance to these needy people. Recently, one of the local television programmes reflected that some ordinary citizens had problems that required assistance but they did not know where to turn to. Moreover, with the language barrier, they found it very difficult to seek help. On many occasions, they went to some voluntary welfare organisations for help, but were turned away as they could not make themselves understood. Even on occasions when they could communicate with the voluntary welfare officers, their cases were not dealt with because they apparently went to the wrong organisation, and they were not referred to the appropriate body. It was a very frustrating experience for these poor folks. In the old days, we had a Social Welfare Department popularly known as Hock Lee Bor in Hokkien. All the old folks knew about it. Whenever they need any help, they could always go to the Social Welfare Department. But now this Department is no more in existence. We have now this Ministry graciously known as the Ministry of Community Development and Sports. To the ordinary citizens, this is a mystery to them. They do not know what this Ministry is all about. I think we should give more publicity to this Ministry to let the people realise that whenever they have any problem they can turn to this Ministry for help. Today, we do not have a one-stop service centre for all welfare work. Sometimes, if the members of the public go direct to the individual welfare organisations, they may not get the relevant one and be given the kind of help required. More often than not, they would be turned away without any referral to the appropriate organisation to follow up with the case. I feel that the Ministry should have a comprehensive one-stop service centre to provide better service to the needy people. With all the modern technology, computer and Internet, we could easily create a network that links up all the 259 members of the NCSS. And with such a better network, I believe the National Council of Social Service would be able to provide better service to members of the public. If a person is to go to any individual organisation for help and if the said organisation could not be of help to the person, the case should be referred to the headquarters in order that it could be directed to the appropriate organisations for help. By so doing, we would be able to assist our people in a more systematic manner, just like what we have described as "sending hot charcoal in a snowy weather". In Singapore, we have never experienced cold winter weather and snow means nothing to us. Maybe, we should say "sending an umbrella during a rainy day". During a rainy day, when one needs an umbrella, let us provide him with an umbrella and he will certainly appreciate it. I believe in sending an umbrella during a rainy day. Our young people will understand that, because there is one song known as In The Rain, which they sing frequently in karaoke sessions. They will understand what it means to be offered an umbrella during a heavy rain. Mr Speaker, Sir, when Singapore is moving towards a highly urbanised and high-technology environment, we should also not forget to place more emphasis on inter-human relationship. The Government has been leading us well and our civil service is very effective, and we are ranked number one in various aspects of our economic development. However, according to a survey by the HDB, our people are found to be lacking in care and concern for their neighbours, and social cohesion among our people is not as strong as before. We have not progressed in this aspect. We should endeavour to enhance our social cohesion to develop the type of kampung spirit so that we would be successful, both economically and socially. I hope that the Minister would consider my suggestion, that is, to set up a comprehensive one-stop service centre for the benefit of our people who are in need of welfare assistance.

Mr Speaker, Sir, I rise to support the Bill. The Bill is progressive and will augur well in enabling the NCSS to remain relevant in the new millennium. The changes are intended to enable NCSS to lead and guide VWOs with speed and effectiveness. That is important because MP Ang Mong Seng has also stressed that. Thus, it is most disappointing to me to see that one major element has not been addressed, and that is, the size of the Board. The current NCSS Act provides for a Board of 22 members plus three additional co-opted members, making it 25. The proposed amendment is good. It is adding one more Vice-President and it has done away with three co-opted members and that reduces the size to 23 members which, in my view, is still far too large. I am of the view that, with the amendments to be made to the Act, it is opportune to consider streamlining the Board for greater flexibility and nimbleness in the decision-making process. Whilst one may argue that there must be representation from Council members, really eight members from the full members and two associate members out of 255 members of the Council really means very little. The Board is there to consider and make the decisions. It is important to have representations and, in my view, it is more important to ensure that there is a mechanism whereby the Board needs members on a regular basis, at least quarterly, if not more often, to collect feedback. And today, with electronic means, there should be constant feedback from members of the Council to the Board. Thus, in my view, 8 from the full members and 2 from the associate members have not much meaning except I would still like to see at least 2 from each, so that when the Board considers matters, you can be assured that the views of the service providers are being considered. I notice that out of the 23 members, it already included the five Head of Divisions. To argue that there must be greater or fuller representation from all the various sectors would just result in a very enlarged Board which is going to slow down the process. That argument does not stand. For example, just take the Disability Division. There are so many forms of disabilities and where does it end in terms of getting everyone represented? Sir, I urge the Minister, while there is still time, even at the Committee stage, to amend the figures and I would be quite happy to see that the numbers provided for full members and associate members be reduced to 3 and 1 respectively. So instead of having the ten representations, we have four, and instead of having 23 on the Board, we will reduce that to 17, which will certainly improve the situation.

Sir, I would like to thank the Members for their views and support. First, let me address the views and comments of Dr Vasoo. He asked whether we could provide further flexibility in the Council with the changes and also whether the representation is adequate. Certainly, there is flexibility, as has been alluded to also by Mr Ee, and the Board could always seek the views of resource persons outside the Board. And certainly in this IT age, the avenues open to the Board to seek views and comments from beyond the organisation are certainly there. In terms of representation, I think it is adequate. Mr Ee says that it is more than adequate and he is suggesting that perhaps the Board could be further downsized. Obviously, there are two conflicting views here. In terms of ownership and changes, there is definitely ownership, in the sense that you have representation by the various VWOs and this has been there all the time and it will certainly increase, given the growing civil society in Singapore and people wanting to do voluntary work and would also definitely want to involve themselves with the Board. I agree with the Member that participation and organisation are important and proper representation is also important. Mr Ang Mong Seng has got several views, both on the state of the NCSS and also on the community although many of them do not really impinge directly on the changes to the Act. But, nevertheless, they are sound views and I appreciate the Member articulating these views. There is one item though which the Member specifically wanted us to do, which is whether we could have a one-stop centre to enable people who want help to come to the centre and be referred to the proper organisation so that their needs could be addressed. Sir, any member of the community could always come to NCSS to seek their help. But, more importantly, members could go to the CDCs too. It is more convenient, it is within their location, and now that we are devolving more and more of our functions to the CDCs, they have full knowledge of who does what and, therefore, could easily refer anyone in need to the proper organisation, and they have Mandarin-speaking officers too. Quite apart from that, they can also go to the Family Service Centres (FSCs). The Family Service Centres would also have with them the organizations that are available to offer the kind of help that is needed by the persons who want them. Mr Gerard Ee asked for a further downsizing of the Board. In stating this, I can appreciate the need to downsize the Board, the need for the Board to be trimmed, to be flexible and to move fast. But at the same time, you have also views like that articulated by Dr Vasoo, ie, the Board should have proper representation from the VWOs. In my view, the amendment now proposed is not so much to downsize the Board but to rationalise the workings of NCSS. But certainly, he will be watching how the changed Board will proceed and how it will work and if there is need to further downsize the Board, I think that is something which we can consider in future.

Question put, and agreed to. Bill accordingly read a Second time and committed to a Committee of the whole House. The House immediately resolved itself into a Committee on the Bill. - [Mr Abdullah Tarmugi]. Bill considered in Committee; reported without amendment; read a Third time and passed.

Mr Jeyaretnam is absent. As he is not here to move his motion, by virtue of Standing Order No. 36(2), the motion lapses.

Resolved, "That Parliament do now adjourn to a date to be fixed. " - [Dr Lee Boon Yang]. Adjourned accordingly at Eight minutes past One o'clock pm to a date to be fixed.